Comments on Ambassador Watch: Life in the LCG - ponder this!

Mr. Grace has posted more information concerning t...

2006-12-23T05:15:00.000+13:00

Mr. Grace has posted more information concerning the sabbath issue in LCG on his site.
http://www.poorboycomputers.com/ponder.html

ok good....so you do exist! (one never knows in th...

2006-12-22T03:13:00.000+13:00

ok good....so you do exist! (one never knows in these internet days)

Mr. Ponder did you a favor actually.....and he simply put you out of that organization, he can't put you out of The Church.

God will lead you to the group He wants you to be a part of, I have no doubt of that. (He did it for us)

It is true that my address doesn't show up on map ...

2006-12-21T05:56:00.000+13:00

It is true that my address doesn't show up on map quest and this was one of the reason I told him it wasn't an accurate measure. However, it doesn't matter if it is only 5 miles from my home, if it takes 3 hours because of our health then it takes 3 hours. Mr. Ponder has never call(when I did have a phone)or email me to check on my wife condition, so he either doesn't care or doesn't want to know. Mr. Ponder put me out of the church about a month ago. So I don't belong but really I left in spirit back in the summer when I seen they were going to support someone for working on the sabbath for 5 weeks. HQ has back him in this decision, and has turn a blind eye to the real truth to this sabbath breaking. I guess they don't remember reading the scripture that it is those that keep his commandment that will inherent the kingdom of God.

then again.....none of the map programs I used sho...

2006-12-20T05:03:00.000+13:00

then again.....none of the map programs I used show a "Chism Loop Rd." in Jasper....

nor do the Graces show up on any of the phone book sites...

hmmmmmm

I hope they walk away from LCG.... the more I rea...

2006-12-19T19:31:00.000+13:00

I hope they walk away from LCG....

the more I read up on that organization the more I see that the leadership is more interested in what HWA said/taught than what God says/teaches in the bible.....

thankfully, there ARE some organizations out there that truly love God's people, and all mankind....they are few in number, but they ARE out there, and their doctrine is much more sound than LCG's (sorry Dr. Thiel ;-)

Hhhhhmmmm, Carl Ponder! Read his reply to the coup...

2006-12-18T18:19:00.000+13:00

Hhhhhmmmm,
Carl Ponder! Read his reply to the couple and am incredulous that he can be the same man who was once touted as a nice man by a late dear friend who knew him. But then why am I surprised? I shouldn't be and I guess will continue to be gobsmacked by such incredible calousness, heartlessness and ignorance of the Bible or even basic decent human civility.
Oy vey vat to do? Leave 'em!....and quickly!!!!
John K

Dennis, you are spot on with your comments about t...

2006-12-17T05:12:00.000+13:00

Dennis, you are spot on with your comments about the Ponder situation. I remember him from decades ago, living in the B'ham area, he from Montgomery. Would get together for HDs, he was a deacon at the time, and abuse was probably not as well noticed at that time. I just remember him as a stable pillar and a seemingly nice guy. The authority of being a pastor can ruin the goodness in a person. Don't any part of that.
enos

Interestingly, back in 2000, after leaving United ...

2006-12-17T04:59:00.000+13:00

Interestingly, back in 2000, after leaving United 9 months earlier, over issues differing from the local pastor's beliefs, like attending a non-ucg feast site, my brother who left with me and I, invited the pastor to our Amish brother's funeral. He was there for the whole service, which was all in German, watched the hand burial, and went back to the house for lunch with a several hundred Amish folks. That really helped us maintain a friendly relationship over the years.
He is a caring individual in that way, and a company man at the same time.
enos

Interestingly, in 2000, after having left United 8...

2006-12-17T04:36:00.000+13:00

Interestingly, in 2000, after having left United 8 months earlier, over issues differing from the beliefs of the local pastor, my brother who left with me, and I invited this pastor to attend our Amish brother's funeral, as a guest. It was his first, an all German service, that started at 9am and ended close to noon. From there went to the cemetary, watched the burial by hand (shovel). Afterwards, went back to the house where several hundred Amish people were for lunch. That really helped us maintain a good relationship with him, in spite of our differences. He is a caring individual, but a company man of course. Too bad not all are like him in that respect.
Enos

This is what happens when you have sheriffs instea...

2006-12-14T10:26:00.000+13:00

This is what happens when you have sheriffs instead of Shepards. Once again, HWA said it best "Rod you know the letter of the law but not the love of the law". Unfortunately LCG does not have God's mercy seat established in its government. No wonder they have the problems unlike any other COG.

Reading this account abouth the man Ponder made me...

2006-12-12T13:48:00.000+13:00

Reading this account abouth the man Ponder made me realize how sick in the head I use to be by allowing men like him spiritually terrorize and abuse me. It's no wonder I am sick of relegion after having gone through the WCG experience.

They do not even come for burials ( "you can handl...

2006-12-12T12:25:00.000+13:00

They do not even come for burials ( "you can handle that, just read some scriptures" we were told)

What?? That's horrendous!

You and I must not have the same pastor. When one member's son died the other week, our pastor went to his funeral. He wasn't the officiating minister, and he didn't speak. But he went anyway.

Oh, and he still does anointing duty. I guess that makes our area one of the good ones.

Sorry you've got such a stinker, Jack.

Anonymous wrote: "Doug's son Scott gave a split-se...

2006-12-12T10:41:00.000+13:00

Anonymous wrote:
"Doug's son Scott gave a split-sermon not long after he arrived out at Charlotte that got him in instant hot water with the powers that be. It was about them all striving to do a better job in their collective schloraship..."

Really?
Now there's a must-play sermon I wouldn't mind hearing for a change!

(Yeah... dream on, john)

lj

Ministry don't go to annoint personally anymore or...

2006-12-12T08:53:00.000+13:00

Ministry don't go to annoint personally anymore or do anything to serve the people.
They do not even come for burials ( "you can handle that, just read some scriptures" we were told)

They are in it for the paychecks.

Doug's son Scott gave a split-sermon not long afte...

2006-12-11T06:03:00.000+13:00

Doug's son Scott gave a split-sermon not long after he arrived out at Charlotte that got him in instant hot water with the powers that be. It was about them all striving to do a better job in their collective schloraship and not be so sloppy and "untruthful"(at least how some in power took it)in their zeal to find sources to back up their belief system.
Winnail's son was right on, but he was the new kid on the block and he stepped on some pretty big toes out there. Not even daddy who is a non-confrontaional CAD could speak up for his son.
The bigwigs do not want to hear anything that goes against "the way it is".
Personally due to my research into the lies, i know Winnail, Ames, Ogwyn and Spanky to be untruthful in lots of what they say and write.
It does not take a rocket scientist to see this. Only those in the cult need to wake up and smell the coffee ,so to speak, and get their heads on straight again. Then they all can see through the B.S.

Winnail's son has been transferred away from Charl...

2006-12-11T04:32:00.000+13:00

Winnail's son has been transferred away from Charlotte...(??)

"Who's on first?" :-)

I still see his name (credit) on the weekly LCG read, er, Update if that means anything.
They do need field ministry in the worst way and he appears to be an excellent speaker from what I was able to glean in a 20 second sound byte regarding medical news.

Do you guys have Charlotte electronically bugged or what? ;-)

lj

There is a lot of nepotism there in LCG including ...

2006-12-11T03:06:00.000+13:00

There is a lot of nepotism there in LCG including Doug Winnails son, who gave up a great teaching job at a university to come out to Charlotte a year or two ago.

Winnail's son has been transferred away from Charlotte. Just like Bryce.

When Meredith transferred Bryce, he told everybody that it was what Bryce wanted, and that it wasn't a punishment. Now, he says different.

Does anybody know what Winnail's son did that got him transferred away from Charlotte? If he has a scandal brewing, like Bryce did, this could cause even bigger problems for LCG, since his Dad is a Meredith bigwig. If LCG says there are no untold secrets behind the young Winnail's transfer, remember that's what they said about Bryce, too.

P.S. I hear Winnail's son only came to Charlotte after he learned his university wouldn't give him tenure. Now, as long as his Dad is an LCG bigwig, he has his "tenure" with LCG.

Dennis, Thank you for the reply. I agree that ma...

2006-12-10T12:16:00.000+13:00

Dennis,

Thank you for the reply. I agree that many if not all were trained to be pastors as well. Yet there were some good ones. As far as obscure wives, I wonder if some of them actually knew that the husband was just there for a check and did not really care either way.

That may be the problem, most of these guys could never make it in the 'real world,' or maybe they got afraid to even try to make it. As an overeaction to that, they make up for it with a superiority complex of sorts. What Ponder did is absolutely shameful, sin if you believe.

What is happening in LCG is also an overeaction to so many questioning 'why?' There is a big backlash amongst many in the ministry about government and following in the true government and that kind of thing. The sheep, or should I say sleep, are waking up after all these years of paying and praying and digging deep one or two times a year. This stuff has no fruits and the new comers are like the proselytes when they come out worse than when they went in. True believers.

"I hope and pray we all can see that this is the e...

2006-12-10T10:15:00.000+13:00

"I hope and pray we all can see that this is the end time...."

You may want to do a bit more investigating on that topic, anonymous. We were told that unto the Jews were given the oracles to preserve. The best Jewish scholars indicate that we have over two hundred years to go until we reach absolute year 6,000 (BCE + CE).

Then, we must deal with the teaching that mankind has 6,000 years on planet Earth, after which God gets his 1,000 years (Millennium). But, nowhere does it say that in the Bible. A man who got 1975 and so many other things wrong did some incredible interpretive reading between the lines to come up with that theory. I have to respect the fact that that man was not ignorant enough to teach that the Earth was only about 6,000 years old (he instead taught "gap theory" creationism). However, even the Bible itself states that no man can know when Jesus will return, alleged Apostle, or not.

The doctrine of the time of the end has been used by the ACOGs primarily as a tool to create a sense of urgency, and to manipulate the behavior of members. How many members do we know who have had no life? They have spent their entire lives disregarding their own educations, retirement needs, health, families, and many other aspects of life to finance a group of men who spend tithes and offerings without even exercising the kinds of modest accountability practiced by charitable secular organizations such as the Red Cross, or the Lung Association!

If you believe that there is only one true church, this next statement won't mean anything to you. The fact is there are many practicing Christians around the world whose altruisms are purer than those of COGsters, because they are not artificially motivated by frightful sermons about 'the end'. These other Christians seem to feel that their hearts have been transformed, motivating them to take the spiritual high road. Of course, ACOG ministers would only have one thing to say about these other Christians: "Let the dead bury the dead". That's the ACOG "catch all" paradigm for dealing with non ACOG members.

What do you think causes all of the splinters and schisms? It is the very propensity towards authoritarianism which causes people to be so inflexible, as opposed to being able to discuss, compromise with one another, and work together. All of these "leaders" are constantly looking towards what they consider ultimate authority as their source! In many cases, their ultimate authority is/was HWA. So if another teacher deviates from HWA's path, one of his lieutenants feels justified in breaking away to follow HWA more precisely. It's a flawed concept, and if they would only make it a priority to preserve the whole, rather fixating on an occasional sacred cow, you wouldn't see all of the splintering. You guys are following some seriously flawed leaders! Can you imagine what would happen if the major corporations around the world were run by such people? Companies would be dissolving left and right, defrauding shareholders of their investments. Fortunately, major companies have boards of directors which steer them along paths of survival and profitability.

BB

RCM is the Don and his captains and lieutenants (m...

2006-12-10T08:03:00.000+13:00

RCM is the Don and his captains and lieutenants (mostly family) serve under him.

A veritable modern King Lear.

Lets add another to the list. RCM's daughter Liz ...

2006-12-10T07:59:00.000+13:00

Lets add another to the list. RCM's daughter Liz works at their HQ. The late John Ogwyn's son Charles, is headed to Charlotte.

It's like the mob out there. RCM is the Don and his captains and lieutenants (mostly family) serve under him. The others are foot soldiers. What a team! RCM has been saying the team out there now is the best since the early 1950's. Must be nice to control, or pretend to control everything.

There is a lot of nepotism there in LCG including ...

2006-12-10T06:39:00.000+13:00

There is a lot of nepotism there in LCG including Doug Winnails son, who gave up a great teaching job at a university to come out to Charlotte a year or two ago.

What's sad is that you DON'T hear about things lik...

2006-12-10T06:25:00.000+13:00

What's sad is that you DON'T hear about things like the Ponder bungle unless you get it from over the internet. Something like that is just holed up in the local congregation and whispered around by the brethren, almost like a ghost story.

At least with Ponder, there is some chance he will finally be dealt with, because he isn't a member of RCM's family. Look around LCG and you will see that it is a cash cow for Meredith family members.

If you're a controversial pastor in the field like Ben Faulkner, you get canned. But if you're a controversial pastor in the field like Rod McNair (related to RCM by marriage), you get promoted to HQ. Once McNair got to HQ, he then got one of his relatives, Mike Germano, hired. Nepotism is the 19th restored truth in LCG.

RCM keeps an incompetent oaf like Dick Ames around as a top manager, instead of just a TV presenter, because he's his brother-in-law, but pushes away more principled and competent men like Charles Bryce who aren't his relatives and who dare to stand up to his nonsense. Meredith put Jonathan McNair on his Council of Elders not because he is a great Bible scholar or beloved pastor, but because he wants to groom another family member for possible succession. Watch for Meredith's son Jim to be elevated in the next couple of years.

Unless Ponder can hurry up and marry into the Meredith family, his prospects don't look good.

What's sad is that you DON'T hear about things lik...

2006-12-10T04:46:00.000+13:00

Annon: I agree totally that all, and I might even...

2006-12-10T00:53:00.000+13:00

Annon: I agree totally that all, and I might even say most of the ministers in my experience as one were very nice guys, compassionate and caring to do the job they genuinely thought was theirs to do. These are the guys and wives whose names you never hear, were marginalized, terminated, sent away never to be heard from again. My last button seems to get pushed when I read accounts like the Ponder Blunder. I don't wish to paint with too broad a brush since I know the minister group well