The Painful Truth About The Worldwide Church of God

Email To The Editor
(Page 43)

(Mail from Kooks, Nuts and Loonies is on another page)

 


12/7/00

The Painful Truth:

 I am a TV reporter in Cleveland, and I know the Worldwide Church of God used to meet in downtown Akron, Ohio. I am wondering if there are any former members who would like to talk to me for a story about their experiences. I'm sure the Worldwide Church of God was active in other areas of NE Ohio as well...and I would like to talk to those former members. I realize many people will not be comfortable discussing this in the media, because as a child my family was in this group.

 If you have any contacts...please pass my e-mail address along to them. I think there is great healing in hearing from others about their experiences. Thanks.

Kim

(Anyone wanting to contact Kim, Email ">send me an email. Editor)


I STUDIED UNDER HWA FOR THE LAST FEW YEARS OF HIS LIFE. I GAINED ENORMOUS AMOUNTS OF KNOWLEDGE. I ATTENDED Worldwide Church of God UNTIL 1992 THEN OFF THE THE PCG. I LEFT BECAUSE OF MR. FLURRY'S UNDERSTANDING OF GOD'S GOVERNMENTAL LAW. I HAVE SINCE STUDIED ON MY OWN AND STILL BELIEVE THAT HWA WAS CORRECT IN HIS TEACHINGS. AT LEAST ACCORDING TO THE BIBLE (KJV). THE NEW Worldwide Church of God HAS FALLEN IN LINE WITH THE CHURCHES OF THE WORLD, NOT UNDER GOD'S LAW BUT UNDER THE CURRENT KING OF THE WORLD. FEEL FREE TO PUBLISH THIS OR EMAIL ME BACK. PLEASE INCLUDED ALL BIBLICAL VERSES ON A SPECIFIC SUBJECT TO EXPLAIN YOUR VIEWS. PLEASE DONT RESPOND IF YOU PLAN ON USING PARTIAL VERSES OR INCOMPLETE STUDIES. ONE THING HWA DID TEACH THAT YOU MUST STUDY A SUBJECT COMPLETLY AND LET THE BIBLE INTERPRET ITSELF. THANKS FOR YOUR TIME AND INFORMATION IN THE INTERNET. IT IS VERY HELPFUL.

REPLY:

 First of all, let me give you a little education in Internet manners:

Writing in ALL CAPITAL LETTERS, is perceived by those on the Internet as YELLING at people. Get it?

Also, writing without capitalizing in the proper places would place a person, in the reader's eyes, as someone that is poorly educated. Just to warn you ahead of time because I suspect that may be what you may do next because it is so hard to hit that Shift key.

Secondly, I don't know how you got to my email address without reading my Email Notice page:

This page very clearly says that you should read the FAQ before sending me email. On the FAQ page you will find the beliefs of the operator(s) of this website very clearly stated.

There will be no Biblical debate. You can read the Bibliolatry Page to find that the book that you worship is not worth the paper it is printed on.  But, I would not throw it out. I would save it for the Great Tribulation where it would come in handy in the Outhouse when your run out of toilet paper.

Any further messages from you will be deleted from my server and not even downloaded to my machine or read.

Editor

PS: You do not give me permission to publish or not publish your email. It is your discretion to send me an email or not send it. It is my discretion to publish whatever I want from what anyone sends me.


 It is very sad that people who are not "Bible Literate" allow themselves to be led into a cult. It is sad that thoes who are leading the cult hide behind an image of GOD that people know to be true and in doing so turn so many away. It seems that you understand that this type of thing is not what my Jesus would have wanted. The saddest thing by far is that people judge the almighty GOD by the actions of people. What about all the decent people and organizations that are not cults. I think anger is misdirected here. Satan won. He has you. Even in your hate of GOD, He still loves you. I do too. I am sorry for your experience and the hate mail from "christians", but please, don't think that just because someone says they are a christian, that they are. GOD is good all the time. I am glad that you are no longer involved in the cult and I wish you a very rich and filled life. Go with GOD.

In Him, Cricket

REPLY:

 Chrysta,

YOU WROTE: It is very sad that people who are not "Bible Literate" allow themselves to be led into a cult

REPLY: That does not mean that I continue to be Bible Illiterate. After 25 years of constant study and belief, I feel I know more about the bible than probably most bible believers. I reject it now, not because I don't know it, but because I do know it.

YOU WROTE: What about all the decent people and organizations that are not cults.

REPLY: Yes, there are a lot of decent people out there doing good things. I gather you are not referring to Christians, who are ALL members of the Jesus cult.

cult \"k?lt\ n 1 : formal religious veneration 2 : a religious system; also : its adherents 3 : faddish devotion; also : a group of persons showing such devotion - cultist n

This Jesus Cult also cannot even convincingly prove, historically, that thier object of veneration, Jesus, even existed. And, you cannot prove that this Satan person exists either.

YOU WROTE: Even in your hate of GOD...........

REPLY: I have never said that.

 YOU WROTE: please, don't think that just because someone says they are a christian, that they are

REPLY: See the FAQ #15 

YOU WROTE: GOD is good all the time.

REPLY: I have seen no evidence of that. In order to believe that god is good all the time, you have to put your brain on hold. If you just go by the bible, all you can see is a seriously confused and confusing "god being" not intent on doing good but on hurting and killing and punishing fallible beings that "IT" created fallible.

I take no shots at the "real" god, if he/she/it exists. I merely state that the real god is not the one found in the bible. The "real" god has been very good at hiding itself from the human race and has shown no discernable interest in us at all.

Editor


 I would respectfully request that you change the wording of your page. The Worldwide church of god suffered a massive split and was divided in many directions. However the congregation that kept the name WWCG though less than a quarter it's original size has become a warm and loving church. Acknowledgment of mistakes made in the past has taught us a lesson on how we should operate as a church and as loving individuals in the body of christ. I am seventeen years old and I have been with the church my whole life. Through the times when we couldn't wear make-up or associate with certain people and to the joyful times now when we are free to worship the way we want to. We are a financially poor church but we have all of the love that we need. I find it extremelly immature and childish however that someone would invent a page such as this. Although I could understand explaining the history of the church by posting all of these stories by people who obviously haven't tried to understand that just because someone may be the head of a church doesn't mean that they don't make mistakes. We are not the perfect ones god is the perfect one. The church as it is now is a loving group that attracts people by it's warmth and willingness to allow people to worship god in their own way and contribut their own gifts. If you and your fellow posters cannot understand this then you have alot more spirituall growth to undergo and I pray that you will someday be able to forgive the church for forcing you "square pegs" into a "round hole" but maybe if you took a second look you would realize the difference between the church now and the church 20 years ago.

Rashah Mcchesney

(proud member of the reformed Worldwide Church of God)

REPLY:

Rashah Mcchesney (proud member of the unrepentant Worldwide Church of God)

I don't know how many times I have to tell you people not to write until you read the FAQ.

You are directed specifically to:

FAQ #2

FAQ #13

FAQ #18

FAQ #32

And, especially FAQ #36

Also, at 17 years of age, let me tell you one thing: You don't know SHIT. Come back 40 years from now and tell me what you think.

Editor


Hi,

I'm still unclear as to who actually writes the Ambassador Report, but I need to point something out. I am Jeff Feazell, the son of J. Michael Feazell. AR issue #67 mentions my name and also quotes a passage from a speech that I gave three years ago.

1) AR claims to quote a letter. That was not a letter; it was a speech that was published in the Worldwide News.

2) AR cites the speech as an example of the emotionalism accepted by Worldwide Church of God and promoted in it's youth camp. That speech had NOTHING to do with the camp. In fact, I have never been to the youth camp. The speech was about DC/LA '97, an evangelical youth conference put on by Youth for Christ.

I would like to contact whoever has inaccurately cited me.

Sincerely,

Jeff Feazell

REPLY:

The person you are looking for is John Trechak, a man we all owe a deep debt of gratitude. You will have to wait until the "millennium" just like the rest of us that would like to take our revenge on Herbert (Wanker) Armstrong because John is also very dead.

Are you saying that Trechak is completely wrong or just technically wrong?

Keep reading the AR's; you will get yourself a good education.

Editor

REPLY:

 From: Jeff Feazell :jeff_feazell@netzero.net

To: Editor

Sent: Thursday, December 07, 2000 3:17 PM

Subject: Re: Ambassador Report

 You're wasting your time. Do something constructive. AR deserves no credit for the changing of any Worldwide Church of God doctrine. What it does deserve is recognition for pride, arrogance, and 13 years of egotistical rock-throwing and slander. The proud are humbled and the humble exalted.

Herber "Wanker" Armstrong? I'm supposed to be the adolescent here. You'll get your "revenge" all right. Don't reply.

 REPLY:

 The AR deserves credit for exposing the rotten corruption that is the past. The present Worldwide Church of God, including your father, takes on all responsibility for the past as long as it keeps all the money from the past and does nothing to fix all the people that were damaged by this church. Didn't your mother ever teach you that, if you break something that is someone else's, you should fix it or replace it? Wouldn't your beloved Jesus teach you to do that also? Then why doesn't your church do that? Hmmmmmmm?

I remember very clearly at a meeting that I was at where your father and mother had absolutely no control over you. Your family was the talk of all the deacons and elders. And your father was preaching at US. Ha! Your behavior shamed him then, just as his unrepentant behavior and greed shames his supposed God now.

Wanker? Just labeling him for what he was. The middle initial should stand for something since it was a fake just to make his name sound better. I figure since he kept a blackbook about his masturbations this name suits him very well. I think Wanker is very generous for this incestuous pig.

Editor


Hi Editor:

Thought the "Painful Truth" readers would be interested in what I came across in this morning's Columbus Dispatch (12/7/00).

On page 3 of the "Metro" section, is a large article with this heading: "Court rehears arguments on Ohio Motto." I would like to quote some portions from what it says. Ironically, the hearing took place in Cincinnati, the spider's nest of UCG.

It begins, Quote: "Federal judges will decide whether the motto's reference to God is constitutional.---CINCINNATI--Ohio's motto, "With God all things are possible" is a generic term, like the one on U.S. currency, and should be preserved, the state argued yesterday in federal court. "To me, it means the same thing as...'In God We Trust,' Associate Solicitor David Gormley told the judges of the 6th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals. But an attorney for the ACLU said the reference in the motto, "With God all things are possible," is much more specific and, therefore, unconstitutional.

The appeals court convened a rare full-court session to rehear the dispute. All 12 active judges in the Cincinnati based circuit --which hears appeals from Ohio, Kentucky, Michigan and Tennessee--participated, along with senior judge David Nelson. Nelson asked about the words used to open the court session, "God save the honorable court." 'Save,' in that context, is not salvation," responded Mark Cohn, the ACLU attorney. He argued that when the motto was adopted in 1959, the words were held out to be those of Jesus Christ to his disciples and implied a state endorsement of Christianity. "The state of Ohio has taken the words of Jesus Christ and said these words are our motto," Cohn said.

 Judge Danny Boggs said his search of usage turned up all kinds of references to "With God, all things are possible," from football coaches to lawyers. "Judge, you and I can invoke the name of Jesus Christ...but the state of Ohio does not have that privilege." Cohn said. (my italics). "What about substituting "the Lord" for "God" in the motto?" Judge Karen Moore asked Gormley. He said maybe. "What about "Allah?" she asked. "No, that suggests a particular god," Gormley said. Cohn argued that rejecting the use of "Allah" but accepting "God" was indicative of the state's double standard. "If "Allah" is not acceptable, the motto sends the message to Muslims in Ohio that they are outsiders," Cohn said. The judge took the case under review and did not say when they would rule.--(Unquote).

John, Columbus, Ohio is one of 6 major cities in the country that attracts lots of foreigners, mostly from Arab nations. And the influx is increasing. In shopping centers and malls you can identify many by their native wear. As devoted as they are to their particular Allah, Buddha, Zoraster, or whatever hell the god they worship, if their population swells, there may come a point in time where they may storm the state house and yank that plague off the wall.

If Ohio must have a state motto, I have the perfect solution: "With Reason and Logic, All Things are Possible." Leave religion the hell out of it.

 Alex


12/18/00

Dear Editor,

As I former (almost baptized) member of the Philadelphia Church of God, I want to thank you for your amazing website.  There is more truth, common sense and logic there ever was in the bible.  The testimonies and books on TPT site have been of enormous help to me and now I am angry with myself (not destructively) for believing such nonsense as I have had thrust down my throat for so long by the PCG.

I had attended my one and only Feast of Tabernacles and I have never been so bored to death in my life.  Two services both Saturdays and a service every day.  Was I the only one to have been looking at my watch and counting the minutes to the end?  Do the ministers really need to take 2 hours to make 1 or 2 points that should of only taken 30 minutes at the most?  Was I the only one to have found the hymns by Dwight Armstrong to be the most monotonous hymns I have ever had to sing?  At least the Church of England hymns were jolly and tuneful and a joy to sing.

I thought to myself, there is something wrong, I should be enjoying the sermons and the hymns, what the hell am I doing here.  I had never been away from my loving husband for so long and I missed him terribly, I was so pleased to see him when it was all over.

Your website has become like the bible to me, I cannot stop reading it.  It is so interesting and a real credit to you, TPT is a real eye opener to people considering taking up religion.  Religion is the most destructive force ever to be put on mankind and is used to control nations in the most destructive way.  Thank you again for this website.

With my very best wishes from Ann


I just read your understanding of taking Gods name in vain. You are right on it. When I resigned or got kicked out of the ministry of the world wide church of god. in 1975. Knowing I had been wrong, the first thing I knew was I had been taking Gods name in vain.

Only ministers can take Gods name in vain.

William


 I read some of what you have written and I felt that I should reach out and thank you for your thoughts .

My name is Vincent and I am in Vancouver, BC and I just found out that, after an absence from the cult my father is now attending it again. It is for this reason that I am now no longer willing to talk with my father any longer..

This Church and I use the word Church lightly is a painful reminder that hate groups such as this are still around...

REPLY:

Vincent,

I hope you will reconsider your decision to no longer talk to your father. I know how difficult it is to deal with these people and how unreasonable they are (I was one of them), but family should come before religion, at least on your part.

Try to be bigger about this than your father. Look at him as though he has a brain tumor the size of a basketball and that you will just tolerate him because he is very sick. Do this out of love.

I remember when I was in the cult, I may have been just like your father. I am very grateful to my parents and my sisters that they did not hold my wacko beliefs against me. (And we thought we were so much better than these "people of the world").

Religion is really a drug for a sickness. It fills the aching emptiness that "god", if there be one, has left in our lives. It presumes to have answers when there really are none. Your father is desperate for answers and probably fearful of dying. He needs hope and reaches out to religion to give him that hope. Pity him but don't shun him.

You will only ever have one father. Don't leave yourself with a life of regrets after he is gone, knowing you could have been the better man than he was and maintained the relationship despite his religion.

Do it for him. Do it for yourself.

Best Regards, Editor


Dear Editor

I have been reading your site "The Painful Truth" for a couple of months now.

I was in the Worldwide Church of God/offshoots for about 20 years. Recently made a decision to leave one of the offshoots, and after that I came across your web-site.

The Worldwide Church of God experience was completely baffling to me... we were sure that what Worldwide Church of God taught us was correct; why else would we stay for 20 years or more?

But it always bothered me that there was not a lot of love in the church... we were told that Christ is head of the church, and that we must just have faith... the TRUTH(??) is that this was just an EXCUSE FOR REFUSING TO ACKNOWLEDGE THE ABUSE IN THE Worldwide Church of God...since Worldwide Church of God was the "true" church, all kinds of mistreatment was therefore justified!!!

I read some of your hate mail... I have to say that I do NOT agree with forgiving Worldwide Church of God... it is true that Christ said we must forgive, BUT Christ did NOT say forgive in ALL cases and ALL situations EVERYTIME... even Christ CONDEMNED the Pharisees... he said they were of their father: the devil!!! DOES THAT SOUND LIKE A FORGIVING ATTITUDE???

The case for forgiving is grossly exaggerated; if we just "forgive" everything this is really saying we don't stand for ANYTHING!!!!!! Many Worldwide Church of Goder's criticize those who become irate at the ABUSE of people who were in the Worldwide Church of God... it's HYPOCRISY: they become irate if I become irate(??!!)...

BUT they are irate because I am irate I am irate because of genuine reasons; abuse etc...

SO, I am NOT allowed to be irate about abuses... BUT they can be irate if I am irate....get it?

Yeah, they can be mean because they are "justified" in their eyes by keeping the sabbath... BUT if you ask where are the FRUITS of the Spirit, such as love...then they immediately hit you with some psycho-babble such as be forgiving, don't be negative, work on your attitude etc...the PLAIN TRUTH is that those who hate "Armstrong critics" want an EXCUSE to continue to be mean...they don't like it if you start asking "but where IS Christianity in the Worldwide Church of God..."

LET ME QUOTE FROM PAUL:

"TRUE RELIGION is this: looking after the widows and orphans"...!!!!

I HATE the Worldwide Church of God and its offshoots... they are EVIL: they spend all their time justifying their vicious behaviour...they think their "superior" belief system saves them...

I left about a year ago because I WAS SICK OF THE HYPOCRISY.... I came to realise that those in the Worldwide Church of God/Offshoots were in NO WAY superior to those outside...BUT they would continue to believe that they are the ONLY ONES who have God's Spirit; everyone in the whole world is wrong except them: well, where is the evidence?????

But they hate me for asking questions, proof or anything...if they want me to be forgiving, THEN WHY AREN'T THEY FORGIVING TO ME??? If they don't agree with my view, then by their own standard, they SHOULD FORGIVE ME, not hate me back!!!!

Furthermore, Christ actually says about forgiving 70x7:

"...IF HE REPENT...thou shalt forgive him 70x7..."

And note that THE CONTEXT is "if your BROTHER shall OFFEND thee..." It is talking about offenses, in this context (minor infractions), NOT ongoing abuses for 20 years or more... do those in Worldwide Church of God really believe that if a woman is RAPED BY A MAN 490 TIMES, that she should forgive this man?????????????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Such is the DISTORTED view of Worldwide Church of God... but they WON"T apply the forgiving principle to me....no sir, never never never!!!!

AB

REPLY:

Andre,

You make a lot of sense in light of the nonsensical thinking of the cultists. But they don't have a problem with being illogical because "faith" does not and cannot be logical. It leads to a way of thinking that cannot be comprehended by "normal" people.

Regards, Editor


Editor,

Your last response to Jeff Feazell called to mind one of our last FOT's in Pensacola (probably 6 years ago) where we had the singularly unpleasant honor of sitting a few rows away from Mike Feazell and his family and grew dizzy from watching him parade his unruly son in and out and in and out of services. The next day we made sure we weren't anywhere near him!

I had forgotten about that until I read your post! :)

Michelle


Regarding your post about Studying under Herbert W. Armstrong:.

First of all, you "think" you gained enormous amounts of knowledge. What you gained was a bunch of mixed up crap. On the PT forum the bible is not used to explain or refute anything, but let me for the sake of argument just say that ol Herbie twisted the meanings of words, peoples, and times putting his own meanings onto them. Thus you can't have any "knowledge" from studying his stuff.

Secondly, HWA gave "lip service" to not using "partial verses" or "incomplete" studies, but in reality that is how his whole bogus "theology" was taught. If you ever sat through a service, in the WWCG you might have noticed that there was flittering from post to post, all over the book not keeping things in the context of the true meaning, and it matters not if the bible is believed or not, it is not the way to read or study it.

 What you "think" you know is just the powerful arrogance that he infused into all of his victims.

As for the KJV of the bible, it is the easiest of all to screw around with and scramble the true meaning of the scriptures and what they are actually saying. A good plain speaking version will take a few of those arrogant scales off your eyes. And some study with other religions will prove that HWA did not even tell the truth about what any of them really believe or taught or teach. He tangled that too.

Then if you study history, you will find out that he twisted all that up too. Not much of anything the man, Herbert Armstrong taught is "truth".

You are being brainwashed by twisting scriptures, control of information, puffing you up in arrogance to think you know something, and listening to this puke over and over and over......so that you believe it. Stop listening to these yokels and go read some history books, some other versions of scriptures, and talk to some other ministers and find out.

Let the bible interpret itself? Never in WW or in Flurries demented group. HWA was God in WW, HE interpreted and explained what the bible "meant", he never allowed anyone to learn anything from the bible itself. All "truth" had to come thru him. Flurry is no different. Try and tell him something you understand different than he is explaining it.. You will soon find yourself expelled from the group, disfellowshipped for THINKING! TRY IT! I DARE YOU! TEST IT! I DARE YOU! Do as your bible instructs.........test the spirits, if you have a kernel of truth to share, try and tell arrogant Flurry it! Or are you afraid?

Then take a look at the hundreds of false prophecies of Herbert's. How many false prophecies doth a false prophet make? ONE! Well he never did anything little. He lied big, sinned big, lived high on the blood of the lambs, and now he is one of the greatest false prophets of our day. Do your homework, and don't just parrot what they say in those "churches" which by the way are cults.

Finish your homework by going to the library and reading up and educating yourself about cults. I dare you. The truth does set you free.

Flurry is just a brainwashed victim leading the brainwashed, parroting what he "learned" from HWA. Garbage, all garbage.

Louise


You have some interesting postings here.....I also grew up in the Worldwide Church of God. I personally would not give them the time of day. I also would not give them the satisfaction or the power to remove me from fellowship...I had the common sense to leave them as soon as I was old enough to get up and go!

The Worldwide Church of God makes a mockery of "family", and "values". Their new policies make their past look even more stupid....it is like they made this complete "turn around" and "all is forgotten". I do not like any of it.

I also refuse to give them the power to ruin my life over it all! After all, I am an adult now, I decide how I feel and what I think, and believe.......sort of takes the wind out of their sails..lol.

As for the bible, it was not written by hwa. It does not endorse him or his "armstrongism" life...and we do not exist because of "evil"lusion...either. That's another lie somebody bought and sold.

Hwa hurt a lot of people, and so did his "ministry"....but I am not going to let it scar me for rest of my life. I choose to believe the bible.....not armstrongism. I refuse to give him the power to turn me away from anything.....that would mean I have no power over my own choices, or emotions, or even over my own mind.

I truly relate to all these "you may have been raised in the Worldwide Church of God if's.." I also hope that all concerned can heal...and can find your own peace...and more than that I have faith that hwa is judged as he did judge.

I also have hope that each one of us has closure....I found mine by my own choice....to look for it...not to spend the rest of my life in regret, remorse or in pain over lost time, and childhood. I am glad you all are finding ways to vent and heal....that is where I began to pull my life back together....starting with taking it back from the Worldwide Church of God.

May all of us be happy, and well, and whole no matter what anyone tries to tell you.

Thank you, Julie, Jacksonville, FL.


I have visited The Painful Truth web site over the past year and have read all the Ambassador Reports on the other web site. Both sites are educational. I've never been a member of this forum.

I've been a member of Worldwide Church of God since 1979. I'm still a member of the "Mother of Harlots" and attend St. Louis North, Phil Perkins pastor. I have no intention of joining one of its daughter churches. My wife and I have decided to stay for awhile, but may eventually move to a Sunday keeping christian church for reasons of our own.

What is this forum all about?

REPLY:

 What is the "Forum" all about?

Here is the description:

"Description:

The forum is here for informational purposes regarding the cult of The Worldwide Church of God, past and present, its Daughter churches and Armstrongism in general and it is here for those who are just looking for a little fellowship among those who have gone through the same experiences."

Probably half of the posters no longer consider themselves "Christian" so, if that offends you, I would not recommend it. No one is attacked for being Christian but nobody should attack the non-Christians. There are no biblical discussions allowed. No bible quoting either. That is one thing that will get you kicked off. The forum is for those that find The Painful Truth website reflects their own viewpoint to at least some degree.

Regards,

Editor


12/25/00

Hi John B:

Your article, as always, called "The Fourth Book of John," was excellent. I've personally thot that (indeed) such truth can be so clothed in the wash of Biblical vernacular, and that truth can be understood better.

Thanx John. I'm still chuckling. How true! Well done.

JohnO.


 Ever since my 1979 baptism I was a loyal triple tithe paying member of the Worldwide Church of God. Although I saw much hypocrisy in the church, even in the ministry, I believed we had the "Truth" and could see no loop holes out of the restrictive old covenant laws.

Then HWA died.

At first the changes were hampered since we had ministers who were still loyal to Armstrongism (George Meeker, Larry Salyer, Wil Malone, Robert Spence). After the UCG split there was a refreshing change and for the first time in my life I did my own biblical research, both Worldwide Church of God and non-Worldwide Church of God inspired. I discovered I didn't need a HWA trained minister to interpret for me. I started reading your website, the Ambassador Reports, and other "dissident literature". I was amazed at how blind (stupid) I had been!!! I came to the conclusion that it actually would have been a badge of honor to get disfellowshiped from the Worldwide Church of God. Something you could frame and mount in the family room and pass on from generation to generation as a family heirloom. Provided you used it as a reminder that you were once slaves in a cult but are now free.

Things in the Worldwide Church of God changed though. Today both my wife and I are more cynical about organized religion, but still believe in the Bible, and still attend the "Mother of Harlots". We feel that we just have to move on, learn from the past, and try to make a difference where we are.

I don't think this forum is really what I'm looking for.

I thank you for the work you've put into The Painful Truth website. I don't agree with every opinion, but it's been a valuable reference source for me. I will continue to visit often and spread the word.

Tom


I am not able to download the Dankenbring files from http ://simplenet.com/mityfall.htm and htt p://triumph simplenet.com/hwainces.htm.

I am instead receiving a "Cannot find server" error message. Can you help me solve this problem. All of your other files are ok.

Thank you.

REPLY:

Apparently Simplenet has been bought out by Yahoo. Don't know where Dankenbring will end up. Hopefully in HELL with all his Non-Minister buddies.

If anyone hears where his new website is, maybe they will let me know.

Editor


Your web-site is most beneficial to my recovery efforts. I was raised in the cult that you address. I am 24 years old. My friend of the same age (also raised in the cult) hipped me to the site. Your work has helped to give us a sense of victory over the evil deeds of those who set us on the paths we faced as children.

My friend and I started a metal band three years ago. We use it as a vent to release all of the fury that has been instilled in us by those who are supposedly wiser than the babies they birth.

I left the cult when I was 16. The local YOU subsequently fell apart as many others followed me out. I am proud of this. I am vindicated by the disillusionment of all the old, self-righteous, child beating freaks that lay in waste after they saw their life's meaning fade away from them. They are doomed to spend the rest of their life with the realization that they wasted the majority of it.

One old man cried to my mother (she is out also) that he wished things could be the way they were. He should have thought of that before he had his son call me and break off our life-long friendship the day after it was announced that I was leaving the cult.

Life is wide open. Those bastards made ours so tiny and restricted. I am free of their illness.

If a God does exist in any way close to the way humans perceive it to, may that God bless your beautiful web-site


 Dear Editor,

This is (Name withheld), the author of the webpages posted on your site .

I know of your new policy of not taking off any page on the author's request, but this page was sent before you had made such a policy. So is it possible for you to take off that page? I will be extremely grateful if you do. Now let me explain.

I have been deluded by HWA for more years than you 30 years. He has played a crucial role in my present state of affairs ,for today I am a total financial failure (because of my strict Sabbath keeping in a land where jobs of any kind was scarce), my marriage and family came very close to total disaster, and now they are at best kept together only because I decided to give up all happiness in this life and endure every shattered dream about a happy life. I believe HWA was a man with a background of incredible sins. But I feel that in spite of his weaknesses God might have used him. Today, I know that the other churches are no better. God did not found denominations or any religious establishments. But I know that a great awesome and incredibly loving God lives. And after discarding Jesus Christ for lack of evidence, today I have chosen to believe in him again. How I came to believe in Jesus again is a long story, which I do not intend to reveal here.

So, Editor, if you are willing, please take off the page. And if you do not, well, I can understand your decision.

Your friend,

Name withheld

 REPLY:

No. I will not take any pages down, period.

You are the only person that knows that you wrote the page so it only affects you in a "bad" way, if I leave it up, while it may affect many in a good way. You know in your heart that you did your best to have it taken down, so be content at that. Jesus will forgive you, in fact, he already has since your are repentant. Why should you feel any responsibility to go back and change something that you feel you did wrong when Jesus does not hold the cultmasters responsible for doing the same thing? And they have done much more evil in Jesus' name than you have.

I am not interested in how you have deluded yourself with religion once again. You had your chance at freedom and have thrown it away. You are wrong. There is no evidence of a loving God; just look at Africa.

Religion is a drug. If that is the only way you can find happiness, be happy in your delusion.

Your Friend, Editor


Hello Friends,

 I noticed your posting of my father's writing, "An Open Letter From God" (actually, the original title, in 1989, was "An Impatient Letter to all of us From God"). I thought you might like to give proper credit to the author, Bo Lozoff, whose work is widely posted on the web. You can see the original letter from God at our own website, www.humankindness.org. The letter was circulating many years, and then when Paul Harvey read it, it was posted on many sites around the world. Paul Harvey later discovered my father as the author and mentioned it on the air, so that most of the sites now mention Bo Lozoff as author, so that if people are interested in seeing more of his work or his several books, they have a clue. My father seems to be winding up his writing and teaching career, and my feeling is that the many people who have liked Letter From God would find his other writings similarly valuable.

 Thanks, Josh Lozoff

PS: The final paragraph (your PS, "I know you are going to say...") is definitely not part of my father's piece, and I think the original gets that point across well enough. I'd love for you to delete that out of respect for the integrity of his intent.

 REPLY:

I went to your website but do not see the original article. I'll take your word for it, though, and give credit where credit is due.

As you say, it was spread around quite freely on the internet.

As for the deletion of the " PS, I know you are going to say that I did not write this letter, but it is just as valid as your Bible. Who are you to say that I did not inspire it, since you believe anything else some men say is My Word? With no proof, I might add! ," now that I have an author that really exists, as opposed to a God that cannot be found, no problem.

Up until now, there was always a chance that it was God really trying to communicate with us, for once, but now it is just a man pretending to be God.

I can't say that I am surprised. Thanks for bringing us all back to reality. Now we can all know for sure that God has not communicated with us through ANY written means. It has always been men pretending to be God.

Your father makes a much more likable and respectable "god" than the "god" of the Bible.

Editor

 REPLY:

Hi,

 Thanks for your response. The original article is under the page, "A Little Good News," as it was one of our old newsletters. Sorry I didn't give you enough information to find it.

Josh


I got on your page a few days ago and did watch the Politically Incorrect Show tonight ---It was kind of interesting. Without your posting about the Show I would never had watched it.

Michael Shermer -Does have the right Idea, One thing, do these people know where religion started from? -If not maybe they should do some extensive studying and I mean extensive studying before they get into it. But maybe that would not matter, I studied and fell into a cult! But I never questioned it! Like on the show it said Cults become a religion or Vise Versa. No more cults or religion for me

I love your page

 Judy


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